WEBVTT

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Daily source code for February
22, 2005.

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Transmeters?

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We don't need no stinkin'
Transmeters?

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Get ready for the Federation of
Rocker!

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Podcasting! It's Adam Curry!

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Oh, hello from San Francisco!

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Everybody, hi!

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Welcome to the Daily Source
code.

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It is Tuesday, February 22,
2005.

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Coming to you from the lovely
Adagio Hotel in San Francisco,
California.

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Your Daily Source code, it's
about 9.30 in the morning.

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It's cold out, let me correct
that immediately.

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It's about 8.30 in the morning.

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I'm so messed up.

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I didn't have any jet lag in New
York really to speak of,
although,

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I was feeling a bit tired around
8 o'clock in the evening,

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only a week of fish in my
microphone.

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Make sure we can hear each other
well.

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But you're out here on the
coast.

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Ooh, yeah.

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It's a little bit wacky.

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I went to bed last night
shooting.

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I think I went up to my room
around 8 o'clock.

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A big black Angus burger steak
for the room service and
crashed.

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And totally crashed.

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In fact, the black Angus burger
is still sitting almost like a
look.

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I wonder what that looks like.

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I've never really looked at my
room service the day after.

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All right.

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Oh, it's that.

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Ooh, yeah.

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That does not look very, you
know what it is.

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Just kind of the fries or the
fries are left there.

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So I woke up before my alarm
clock this morning.

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I had a set for eight o'clock
because I wanted to talk to the
girls back home.

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Since we now have a eight hour
time delay.

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You know, when you're hooking up
with people you're meeting and,
you know,

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it's always inconvenient time to
just talk for a little bit.

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And the wonderful thing, of
course, is that, you know,

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these days you can talk for
hours and hours and hours with
anybody you want in the entire
world

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because of Skype.

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And I use Skype out since, you
know,

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Patricia likes just the regular
handset and I still haven't
completely,

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I still haven't ordered that
Skype handset for downstairs.

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But even so, you know, what do I
pay like,

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it's like two cents a minute to
call anywhere in the world.

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Skype just absolutely rules.

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So, unfortunately though, this
hotel, even though they have

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an amazingly fast connection,
it's really nice.

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It's a wired connection.

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So you have to, you have to plug
in.

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It's not wireless.

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So otherwise I can walk around
the room and do all kinds of
stuff.

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And I have the world's largest
cell phone, basically.

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And the reason why I can't do
that now is because it's one
thing that

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Mac is done that is really not
smart on the power book is you
have two

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stereo speakers.

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So you got, you know, speaker on
the well, you have stereo
speakers.

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So one stereo on the right hand
side of the power book,

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one on the left hand side.

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The microphone, the internal
microphone,

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is actually built into the left
hand side of the power book,

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which is right next to the
speaker.

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So if you're on a Skype call,
you're not wearing headphones on
your

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power book, then whatever the
other party says,

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they will hear that come back to
them and kind of like a delay

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depending on the latency of the
connection,

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but that could be almost be, you
know, just like an echo.

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So, not very handy.

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So I was wondering how they
fixed that with,

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because I've used I chat, I chat
AV,

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which I like quite a bit if
you're doing video chats.

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And I've used that a lot and
I've used it hands free without
headphones.

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Like, what are they doing?

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What is different?

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You know, is it the software?

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Is it filtering it out?

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Until then I figured it's
actually pretty simple.

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What they did with I chat AV is
the audio from the other party

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that you're talking to comes
through the right speaker only

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and they disabled the left
speaker.

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Okay, that would remove the,
that would remove the horrible
echo effect

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for sure, but it's kind of like
a, you know, like a, you know,

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well, it's not a very
interesting fix because, you
know,

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Skype doesn't know how to do
that, I guess.

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Maybe Skype can figure out how
to chop one channel off.

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Anyway, that would be nice if we
could get that working.

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Because I do like the idea of
talking hands free

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and I've been investigating some
equipment

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while I've been here in the
States.

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Looking for, see, I went into
New York.

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Well, first, when I'm looking
for, I'm looking for a pair of
wireless headphones.

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They aren't too bulky to take
with you, you know,

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and actually even better,
perhaps.

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And that's why I went into New
York.

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I went to Sam Ash, which is a
famous store for musicians

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where you can buy instruments
and all kinds of gear.

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Managed music stores right next
door across the road.

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And I'm looking for two things.

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One is for a, kind of like the
Madonna headset,

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which has a monitor there as
well.

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So it's basically a telephone
headset,

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but it would be wireless.

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So it have one little box that I
hook up to my laptop.

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And then I, and I could walk
anywhere I want

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and receive the call that I'm
getting.

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And of course, use the wireless
mic.

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And I could do the same when I'm
recording the source code

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because, you know, I'm pretty
constrained.

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I have to sit right near the
computer

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because of the length of the
headphone cord

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where it's, I love roaming
around as much as possible.

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I was also looking for a small,

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yes, a little teeny battery
powered mixer.

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You know, something that I could
just use on the road

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because I stupidly forgot my eye
river.

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And I have the yep here, but the
quality of what that records

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is nowhere near what I could do
with eye river.

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I can't believe I forgot to
bring.

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And I thought I had everything
with me.

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So I haven't really been able to
do any of the outside stuff

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that I was, you know,
potentially planning on, on, on
doing.

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And I couldn't find it.

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I could not find the little
mixer.

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There were lots of, you know,

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a little bit bigger mixers,
which would actually work quite

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in a nice state home.

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But I want something I can take
on the road.

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And I was talking to Madge
Weinstein, who was in Florida

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talked to her for a couple of
minutes the other day.

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I said, Madge, you know, what
are you using?

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And Madge is using a mixer from
radio shack.

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And I went, yeah, I got to hit
the radio shack.

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The radio shack always has
exactly that plug

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that you never thought existed

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conversion cable that no one
would ever dare make.

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And if not, they've got all the,
all the plugs in the wires

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and the solder and the soldering
iron

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for you to put it together
yourself.

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Hmm.

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So I'm taking a sip of tea here.

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In the room, they have a,

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it's a nice hotel, by the way.

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They have a little beverage
center.

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So of course, you got a mini
bar.

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But then they have a coffee and
tea.

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And you can set that yourself,
which I always like.

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I really, really enjoy just
being able to make my own coffee

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and not have to order up or tea.

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Because I like drinking tea a
lot.

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And what happens inevitably,
usually in US hotels.

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I don't know about San
Francisco.

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But in most hotels in the
States, if you order up a tea,

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you have at least a 70% chance
that the tea water

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has been put into a container
that held coffee

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and it just tastes like shit.

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So it's nice that you can, you
know, kind of control that
yourself.

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So daily source code.

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Today, we want to talk about
commercialization,

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because that's been what a lot
of my trip has been about.

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I want to talk about radio,
because I've gotten so much
feedback

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from so many smart people,
particularly in New York,

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about the future of radio, where
they think it's headed,

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you know, just, well, the future
of radio, where they think it's
headed.

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They're not enough.

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And today, this afternoon, or I
think, yeah,

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that's probably a cocktail thing
or whatever,

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but this afternoon, this
evening,

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are the, the wired rave awards.

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So I was planning on

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gussying up a little bit and
going to check that out.

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And just a chat a little bit for
the next half hour.

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So with you guys, talking about
some stuff,

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and of course, we've got a hit
test, you know,

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a young poet.

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He would never let you down.

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He's gotten number 13 lined up
for today.

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And I have, let's see, got a
mashup.

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This is, I can't remember who
sent me this,

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but I don't know if it was, if
it was said or not.

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But it's cute tip versus huge
Lewis in the news.

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It's called The Power, Don't
Stop, Mr. Shaky Hands Man.

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Yeah, if you got it.

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You got it?

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[ Music ]

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Only call it was Mr. shaky hands
mix what is it the yeah Mr.
shaky shaky hands man

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All right, it's all your daily
source code for today, which I
remind you if you're just
getting started with your day

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Every ball that it doesn't
really matter what day it is
because you know you're getting
this maybe a day later or two
days later

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Hey, something funky I noticed

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I have a Sony Erks and what is
it?

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K 700i telephone which I use in
the UK. I have Virgin Mobile as
my provider and

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I didn't really notice it at all
until Patricia

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Until I called Patricia
yesterday and she said oh, you
know did you hear the message? I
left it not in getting you
message

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It just said did you call me so
yeah, you know called you on
your phone and I'm I look at

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Low and behold no network. I've
done the rescan

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I've done everything I can it's
it's not receiving a network. It
works fine in New York work to
find well

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I know it works in when it works
in New York fuck it

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But why isn't it working here
and I have another cell phone
which is

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That I carry with me usually if
I go to Holland because it's my
Dutch cell phone and that does
get a network here

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So I'm kind of pissed that the
Virgin for some reason. I don't
know they just don't have a

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If they don't have a Rome I mean
why don't pick up a network? It
would that doesn't make sense
that

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Well, they just don't have a
network that they roam with they
be that is indeed the the

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The problem what's that?

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Yeah

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I thought I heard some
interference. I just put fresh
batteries into the wireless set

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So that shouldn't work fine for
a while, but you know, I think
if you've got a city where your
airplane airplane's fly from

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And Virgin Atlantic flies from
San Francisco twice a day

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Then perhaps it would be kind of
smart to have

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Your mobile telephones work in
the city, but maybe it's just
this particular area of the
city. I don't know

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So I want to talk to you bit

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about

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The future of radio and what
I've learned what the feeling is
from people

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Particularly who are either in
radio or a different forms of
radio or

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Or an advertising and advertised
for radio and I think I can sum
it up from our

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Conversations in New York with
and again advertising folks that
I know

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Radio people marketing people
who sell sponsorships and
advertising for radio

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They're pretty much scared
shitless

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I can't say it any other way.
Well, maybe not scared

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Well, yeah, I think scared is
probably the right word because
they know they know and everyone
who's in radio knows

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That there is a whole generation
coming up that does not give a
shit about radio doesn't care
doesn't listen and

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You know, and we think about it.
Well, yeah, that's my daughter.
My daughter is part of that
generation and anyone who has
kids

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And if they're let's say
anywhere between like 11 and 14
or you know

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If you got pre teenagers or
teenagers and listen to radio
the way you use to they've got a
whole bunch of other things

14:58.460 --> 15:01.460
They're doing they have MSN that
they're on all day

15:01.460 --> 15:06.180
They have their iPod that
they're filling up and and maybe
they're not even listening to
podcasts

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But they have an iPod that's how
they're enjoying their
entertainment. They've got an
Xbox

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You know, there's all this stuff
that is basically detracting
from and in this case

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I'm just going to talk about
radio, but because of course
television has pretty much

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You know the same issues and the
people that do listen to radio

15:21.500 --> 15:26.140
I think that they're pretty
disenfranchised that's at least
what we've you know what we've
kind of in our

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In our little informal studies
have seen is that you know, wow

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People are bored. They're
running away

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There's there's not a lot that
they'd like to listen to
everyone knows it's there and
everyone has the radio on at
some point

15:41.860 --> 15:46.420
And it may be just a backdrop
for for you know, like a
soundtrack to your life

15:46.420 --> 15:50.380
But you know that's what people
are basically choosing to
program themselves

15:50.380 --> 15:52.820
You know setting up their own
playlist and I have to say by
the way

15:52.820 --> 15:58.900
I don't think that many people
use playlist features on MP3
players and to prove that

15:58.900 --> 16:02.820
I guess or the proof would be in
the pudding is why Apple came
out with the shuffle

16:03.740 --> 16:06.380
Because that is pretty much a
thing what everyone was doing

16:06.420 --> 16:12.700
And at the beginning you set up
your playlist and of course
you've got a playlist that is
just right to get everyone in
the mood for

16:13.100 --> 16:19.460
Something sensual or something
fun or if you want to pick me up
or you know a rainy day

16:19.620 --> 16:23.260
Played list, but after a while
you get kind of tired of it
because guess what it's like
fucking work

16:23.260 --> 16:25.260
You know

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I

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Actually once made a playlist
generator. I should dig that
code up. It was pretty cool

16:30.480 --> 16:35.000
Cuz you know radio stations have
have a format and the format is
well first of all

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There's probably a genre most
radio stations have to have a
genre

16:38.240 --> 16:42.240
So we play the best of the 60
70's n80's everybody. Oh, we
play today

16:42.960 --> 16:47.800
Racking it or we play the light
only the light or all talk all
the time

16:48.880 --> 16:53.920
But let's just take music for a
second even within those
formats. So let's take a

16:54.920 --> 17:01.040
60 70's 80's mixed station or
70's 80's 90's or what is it
80's 90's and today?

17:02.320 --> 17:09.600
So basically that could be my my
iTunes or my my iPod could be 60
70's 80's 90's and today

17:10.080 --> 17:14.160
But you know what it does a
format do well a format is a
clock

17:14.640 --> 17:17.920
And if you would take a clock
and split it up into sections
let's say

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Five minutes sections that would
pretty much equal what just
about every single radio station
and on the planet has is their
format

17:25.360 --> 17:30.880
And oftentimes the format is of
course a secret formula for
success and no one really talks
about their format

17:31.440 --> 17:36.720
But a station may start off the
top of the hour with a big hit
golden old

17:36.720 --> 17:38.480
And these are all tagged by the
way in

17:38.720 --> 17:43.120
Programs that radio stations use
the most prevalent one is called
selector and

17:43.440 --> 17:51.440
They have all kinds of tags, you
know, it's like if it's the tag
would be female artists tag
would be sunny song happy song
up tempo

17:52.880 --> 17:54.080
You know

17:54.080 --> 18:01.040
Probably well obviously the the
date range so there's a whole
bunch of ways that that songs
are tagged and I wish we could
merge

18:01.680 --> 18:04.480
some of the professional stuff
that is out there

18:05.520 --> 18:10.960
Into more like a prosumer
version because all the all the
study that on the stuff has been
done, you know

18:10.960 --> 18:16.320
It's it's all been developed.
It's just in very expensive
packages that we really can't
access as podcasters

18:16.320 --> 18:18.320
But so that format will say all
right

18:19.280 --> 18:22.160
We'll start off with a song from
the 60s that we want to hit a

18:23.440 --> 18:28.640
Recurrent which means something
from the past five years then we
want to go with an 80 song

18:28.640 --> 18:31.120
And we'll do another 80s but a

18:32.080 --> 18:36.880
A slow song and then from that
slow song will go into an up
tempo. So that would be the
format and what I created

18:37.360 --> 18:38.560
many years ago

18:38.880 --> 18:42.480
Was I had all these tags. I'd
basically tag my music

18:42.480 --> 18:46.720
But I did it just simply first
by a tempo and by a date range
and

18:47.200 --> 18:51.600
Had a format which would say
exactly that I want to start off
with this type of song that song
will be next

18:51.600 --> 18:55.600
And please make sure that you
don't repeat a song right so
there's no repetition within the
hour

18:55.600 --> 19:02.000
Don't repeat the artist and it
would just delve into my iTunes
and and pull out songs and
create a

19:02.320 --> 19:05.760
Format for me and it would start
playing and when it was almost
at the end of that playlist

19:06.080 --> 19:12.400
It would create a new one so I
basically had this automatic and
this loop running throughout the
house now on your iPod that's a
little more complicated

19:14.080 --> 19:18.720
But really, you know, who's
gonna go through all that
trouble of tagging their music
and doing all that?

19:18.720 --> 19:22.960
You know, it's it's not what you
do is you put it on random and
if it hit it the random hits the
song

19:23.360 --> 19:28.640
That you don't like you just you
know hit the the the the the
skip button and you go to the
next one

19:29.760 --> 19:31.760
So there's a big

19:31.760 --> 19:33.760
Big opportunity I think

19:34.320 --> 19:37.680
How do we how do you even start
on talking about this about the
randomizing okay?

19:37.680 --> 19:42.480
Well, so anyway, yeah people are
randomized and creating their
own stuff and and they're really

19:43.040 --> 19:46.800
They're probably manipulating
more than actually creating
there's always die-hards

19:46.800 --> 19:50.320
But I think the majority of
people don't bother creating
playlists

19:51.440 --> 19:53.440
The point being that

19:53.920 --> 19:56.640
Radio sees that it's in trouble
now of course

19:57.600 --> 20:01.360
Several years ago and I didn't
even realize that this was like
goes back to you know

20:01.680 --> 20:06.720
Almost more than 10 years ago is
when the satellite guy started
to figure out this exact problem
and

20:07.360 --> 20:15.280
That you know, we they would
have to figure something out to
you know to be able to either
offer more programming or
different programming

20:15.680 --> 20:21.360
Or and this is all pre iPods
when they set up these satellite
radio stations which is supposed
to be the big alternative to

20:21.680 --> 20:23.680
terrestrial radio broadcast

20:24.240 --> 20:28.480
There were no iPods so they
thought that they would be the
shit. They would be the bomb
digity and that how all these

20:28.880 --> 20:33.440
You know these pre-programmed
channels which would give you a
format, you know very much like
what we see

20:34.240 --> 20:35.760
in our playlists

20:35.760 --> 20:41.680
And of course those markets
crossed each other and then they
went oh shit, you know, we've
got to come up with something
else at the same time

20:41.680 --> 20:47.840
I think the satellite guys also
realized that you know users
were defecting listeners didn't
want to

20:48.640 --> 20:51.280
Stick around anymore. They're
bored of what they're hearing
and

20:51.920 --> 20:53.920
And

20:53.920 --> 21:00.720
One of the biggest misnomers by
the way if we it's of course
obviously this comes into a
Howard Stern conversation
because radio can be all kinds
of things

21:00.720 --> 21:07.520
It's not just music. It's not
just all talk. You know, it's
it's radio is a technology.
Okay. It's you can't put

21:08.480 --> 21:16.240
Podcasts in a box and say this
is a podcast, you know, there's
this is a podcast and cover
villas a podcast and a skinny on

21:16.240 --> 21:23.040
Sports as a podcast and rock
roll kick shows a podcast and
match wine is a podcast and wine
seems a podcast and Don and Drew
is a podcast

21:23.040 --> 21:25.680
Everything's a podcast. It's
just a technology that's being
used

21:26.400 --> 21:30.240
And it can be a for profit
podcast and not for profit
podcast and none in

21:31.280 --> 21:33.280
podcast, you know fucking
understand

21:33.280 --> 21:36.080
you know it's just a technology
so

21:38.160 --> 21:44.080
The big miss understanding I
think about Howard Stern and of
course I want to talk a little
bit about his move to serious
radio

21:44.800 --> 21:46.800
is that

21:46.800 --> 21:48.480
serious which has no

21:48.480 --> 21:55.680
FCC regulations or not regulated
by the FCC they are regulated
interestingly enough by the
digital millennium copyright act

21:56.240 --> 21:59.200
Which gives them some other
hurdles they have to address

22:00.640 --> 22:08.240
Anything goes so you can say
whatever you want essentially
very much like a podcast because
it's not regulated by the FCC

22:08.720 --> 22:15.520
People who think that because
Howard Stern now can say shit
piss fuck tits count
motherfucker cock sucker

22:15.520 --> 22:20.480
Whatever the seven dirty words
are that all of a sudden, you
know, this is gonna be like some
big

22:21.520 --> 22:27.760
Revelation, you know other
people are saying oh, you know,
maybe he'll be like Lenny Bruce
and once he gets all this
freedom

22:27.760 --> 22:34.960
People won't be as interesting
anymore and I say nay to both,
you know, this is not what
Howard Stern is about Howard
Stern is not about

22:35.520 --> 22:42.960
Saying dirty words or or being
indecent Howard Stern is about
honesty and

22:43.280 --> 22:47.920
This is something that I learned
a long long long long time ago
when I started first moved to
New York

22:47.920 --> 22:53.360
It started listening to him is
that he would just he wouldn't
put on the fake voice. He
wouldn't you know

22:53.760 --> 22:58.480
Pretend to be someone else
although that is obviously
always a bit questionable

22:59.200 --> 23:01.200
for everybody me included

23:01.680 --> 23:07.680
But he was just telling stories
and telling talking about his
life and and talking about stuff
that interested him and and
guess what?

23:07.680 --> 23:13.440
You know in all honesty in all
honesty many guys like to talk
about

23:13.920 --> 23:14.960
sex

23:14.960 --> 23:16.960
Is it a surprise to you

23:17.600 --> 23:22.880
So if that's what people want to
talk about and they can talk
about it honestly and openly and
use the words that I mean

23:22.880 --> 23:25.360
Look life is indecent life is
indecent

23:25.360 --> 23:29.040
I've said this before the way we
talk the way we communicate with
each other are actions

23:29.360 --> 23:34.320
What we write it just everything
it's indecent by today's FCC
standards

23:35.360 --> 23:38.240
I don't think it's indecent I
don't care what you say to me
how you say it

23:39.520 --> 23:43.360
But it is deemed indecent by the
broadcast regulations

23:44.400 --> 23:49.440
But it's nothing so it's not
about the language it's about
being honest and being able to
say

23:49.840 --> 23:54.160
Whatever's on your mind and
starting a debate and if it's
about lesbians that's fine

23:54.880 --> 23:57.600
You know Howard Stern is not
always about lesbians either

23:58.240 --> 24:01.280
So I completely believe he will
bring

24:01.920 --> 24:06.720
An enormous following he has
about eight million listeners
now. He claims a bit more, but
eight million

24:06.720 --> 24:12.560
I'd say he's a pretty fair
number across the US and he has
to bring one million subscribers
to

24:13.280 --> 24:17.520
To serious and then they
basically make make money. You
know, he's making hundred
million a year

24:17.520 --> 24:21.760
If he brings in a million
subscribers then they have then
they're probably gonna do

24:22.480 --> 24:28.320
Just on the Howard Stern deal.
They're going to make a minimum
of 20 to 30 million dollars a
year

24:28.320 --> 24:35.360
Pre-tax because Howard brings in
enough to cover it up. You know
a subscription to serious radio
costs was at 12 or 14 bucks

24:35.920 --> 24:40.000
12 bucks a month so you wind up
paying 140 bucks so do that
times a million want you

24:41.680 --> 24:46.960
You see that you're at a hundred
and forty million dollars and if
Howard Stern cost a hundred so
there's you know

24:47.200 --> 24:50.000
30-40 million left over so that
makes total sense

24:52.400 --> 24:54.400
The question is

24:55.120 --> 24:57.920
Since Howard Stern can't make
the move until 2006

25:00.080 --> 25:08.240
Will people start defecting to
other avenues before then can
they wait that long or are they
finding that podcast or
delivering a lot of

25:08.240 --> 25:11.360
Because that's what I keep
hearing people say over and over
they say

25:12.240 --> 25:14.240
I don't know why I listen to it

25:14.240 --> 25:20.720
You know this person doesn't
have a great voice or you know
he says um and uh and the
quality sucks and you know

25:20.800 --> 25:27.600
What what is it it's about the
honesty and please make no
mistake. It's not about the
amateurism of

25:28.480 --> 25:33.840
The podcast that can be a part
of the entire vibe and people
don't really give a shit

25:33.840 --> 25:36.480
I think that's what we're
finding out you know it's like
college radio

25:36.960 --> 25:40.800
You know I don't give a shit if
you if you crack the mic the
wrong time

25:40.800 --> 25:44.320
I just want to hear what you
have to say and it's kind of
funny you know and I think that

25:44.720 --> 25:49.200
The amateurism and the
unprofessionalism that you might
hear once in a while or all the
time

25:49.280 --> 25:54.480
Doesn't matter whatever podcast
you're listening to it. It's
just it's exciting to hear
something you haven't heard you
know

25:54.480 --> 25:56.480
so after a while after

25:56.480 --> 25:57.680
we're all

25:57.680 --> 25:59.680
You know we're used to listening
to crappy

26:01.040 --> 26:05.840
Non-professional podcast then
the occasional one that is
produced a little more slicker

26:05.840 --> 26:08.160
Well, that'll be exciting. So
that's just what we're used to

26:08.400 --> 26:13.440
But it's about the honesty. It's
about hearing people talking and
and you can almost

26:14.240 --> 26:18.800
Sense that they don't have to
hold back. There's nothing in
the back of their mind that they
can't talk about

26:19.200 --> 26:21.200
There's no you know corporate

26:21.920 --> 26:23.600
I was like what we talked about
the CBS

26:25.040 --> 26:27.840
When I was interviewed by CBS
for CBS evening news by the way

26:27.840 --> 26:36.880
They're holding back on
releasing that report. This is
great because they they want to
do the report about podcasting
in conjunction with launching

26:37.200 --> 26:39.200
CBS news is own podcast

26:40.240 --> 26:44.320
I feel a bit used but it is kind
of exciting so that'll be cool
to see that happen

26:46.560 --> 26:48.560
So

26:49.920 --> 26:53.360
You can tell and that's what's
getting everyone hooked on these
things because

26:53.920 --> 27:00.800
You know you can tell and of
course after a while if it's not
interesting or it's not
entertaining and a tune out no
matter what which is why you
know

27:01.840 --> 27:05.120
I keep my time in check. I don't
want to do more than 40 minutes

27:05.120 --> 27:09.920
I have my balls aren't big
enough to say I think I can
entertain you any longer than a
3040

27:10.480 --> 27:12.480
30 or 40 minutes that I do every
day

27:13.040 --> 27:16.800
So in the conversations in New
York we talked a lot about

27:19.680 --> 27:21.680
ways to move

27:21.920 --> 27:23.920
Advertising money revenue

27:24.640 --> 27:29.680
From radio where it wants to
leave because the numbers are
dwindling into new areas

27:30.480 --> 27:34.480
Now with serious it's an an XM I
should mention them as well the
two

27:35.280 --> 27:36.880
Satellite radio networks in the
U.S

27:37.760 --> 27:39.920
They're doing a combination
mainly subscription

27:40.640 --> 27:45.120
But they will also be doing
advertising and how it's turn
will carry advertising as well

27:45.200 --> 27:50.800
So you're going to pay a monthly
fee and you'll be subject to
advertising by the way

27:50.800 --> 27:53.680
I don't have a problem with
advertising. I like listening to
it if you know I like

27:54.240 --> 28:00.080
Being marketed to I like hearing
about new products if I don't
then I'm gone. You know, so you
can lose me really easy

28:00.080 --> 28:04.000
But it's not you know, I've
nothing against advertising.
It's a fact of life. You know

28:06.800 --> 28:12.480
So there are people looking to
to move into the new market now.
We don't really have

28:13.040 --> 28:16.880
The eight million listeners that
Howard Stern has you know, we
don't you know, I have

28:17.600 --> 28:22.480
What we up to like you know,
well we're well over the 50,000
mark that I had several months
ago

28:23.120 --> 28:29.760
But you know, it's still if if
you look at it, you know, they
use something called a cost per
thousand CPM cost per meal

28:31.840 --> 28:35.280
To determine you know how much
is paid per

28:35.840 --> 28:41.840
Per advertisement and that's
just not going to work. That's
like you're trying to shoehorn
the wrong thing and to you know

28:42.080 --> 28:45.680
It's kind of like what happened
with banner ads, you know, and
now

28:45.680 --> 28:50.880
You know, all everyone cares
about the banner banners of the
same size and it's just it's
it's

28:51.360 --> 28:56.480
It's not very innovative. It's
not the best use. I think of you
know now we have all this
freedom

28:56.480 --> 28:59.360
We can do it every one what a
revolutionary concept

28:59.360 --> 29:05.840
Maybe we could make commercials
interesting and not having be
just 10 20 or 30 seconds maybe
we can integrate them into

29:06.400 --> 29:12.560
Into programming and I've really
and I've really thought about
how and and that was part of my
point of being out here in San
Francisco

29:12.560 --> 29:19.840
I want to talk to a lot of the
top podcasters and get their
feeling for you know, what are
they looking for and and what's
been interesting is

29:19.840 --> 29:23.040
I've been talking to a lot of
people out here on the west
coast

29:24.240 --> 29:27.440
Every single person wants to
make money on what they're doing

29:28.400 --> 29:32.400
I think everyone's very
realistic and understand that
it's no one's going to be making
a

29:33.040 --> 29:35.040
billion dollars in any type of

29:35.760 --> 29:38.880
You know any type of new media
venture just because

29:39.520 --> 29:42.080
You know the numbers it doesn't
add up, you know

29:42.080 --> 29:44.080
It's unlike the old

29:44.080 --> 29:48.960
centralized model where you'll
have a few people who have all
the viewers and all the
listeners now

29:48.960 --> 29:55.600
We have a much larger scope
where you're going to have your
15 listeners or your 150 or
maybe your

29:56.560 --> 30:00.480
5000 you know it all depends on
what you're doing and obviously
the more

30:00.960 --> 30:06.080
People that are in there the
more interesting will be for
advertising but it's not just
about advertising because we you
know

30:06.080 --> 30:08.080
I've been testing a couple
models

30:08.080 --> 30:12.080
I have to say that I am just
tickled pink about this whole
San Seo deal

30:12.320 --> 30:14.880
So, you know, here's a way you
to make money with a podcast

30:15.120 --> 30:21.760
You like something and you talk
about it and then all you have
to do is make sure you give
people an opportunity to check
out that product and go buy it

30:21.760 --> 30:23.760
I like lots of stuff

30:24.240 --> 30:26.960
And actually what I've noticed
with the Amazon associates

30:26.960 --> 30:31.840
You know, I'm gonna associate
with Amazon and I've been
talking about the San Seo coffee
maker because I like it

30:31.840 --> 30:35.680
I use it. It's a great product.
I wish I had it here with me on
the road and by the way

30:35.680 --> 30:41.360
I thank you everyone so much for
all the emails and the pointers
on how to create your own coffee
pods and

30:41.440 --> 30:43.680
Fill them up with other things
besides coffee

30:44.880 --> 30:49.440
Next time I'm an Amsterdam. I'll
be sure to create a really big
pod that I'm gonna try it out

30:50.080 --> 30:54.320
You know, and people are
interested, you know, look at
coffee futures

30:54.320 --> 30:58.160
You know coffee is a big ass
market lots and lots and lots of
people drink coffee. So

30:58.720 --> 31:05.760
I'm talking about something as a
product. I don't even make, you
know, if I made the product it
would probably be better and if
my podcast was only about coffee

31:05.760 --> 31:11.120
I would probably sell more of
them but just through the fact
that I'm talking about this
great coffee machine that I like
that I use

31:11.120 --> 31:15.760
And I want you to be able to
have the same wonderful San Seo
coffee pod experience

31:16.160 --> 31:17.920
You can go to curry.com

31:17.920 --> 31:22.960
Click on the on the picture of
the coffee machine and you'll be
able to buy it now because you
buy something

31:23.360 --> 31:28.880
I get a percentage and right now
I'm beginning like five percent
or something, you know, that's
Amazon's deal

31:28.880 --> 31:33.040
So I'm not really feeling
extremely happy but what if it
were my product? What if it were
my CD?

31:33.360 --> 31:37.040
Like the lascivious bitties.
They're gonna be doing their
bitty cast. It's already
started. So

31:37.440 --> 31:42.480
They're gonna be talking about
themselves and on the road and
you'll get hooked or you won't
get hooked and

31:42.560 --> 31:48.160
And you'll want to buy the CD.
It's just the way it works, you
know, it's on television. They
have a word for it

31:48.160 --> 31:54.000
It's called an infomercial now
of course that conjures up all
kinds of images of really bad
actors and

31:54.800 --> 32:01.200
Overdubbed voices of you know
with beautiful bodies who have
these wonderful machines that
could make you as tone and fit
as well

32:01.200 --> 32:06.320
But it is a bit that's very
successful, you know for
companies that make or or

32:06.880 --> 32:14.800
Market those products so very
much I guess I have to admit
like what Dave Weiner has said
many times on how to make money
on weblobs

32:14.800 --> 32:21.920
Only now it kind of you know
we've opened up this whole new
area of of creativity and
opportunity for people who just
aren't writers

32:21.920 --> 32:26.640
I'm not a I'm not a writer. I'm
not a good writer. I'm a shitty
writer. I don't you know, just
don't I'm not good at it

32:26.640 --> 32:29.440
I always fire stuff off and just
post it up to the blog

32:29.440 --> 32:32.800
I don't really think about it
and go back later and think oh,
I could have committed that
better

32:33.120 --> 32:38.800
This is my my arena. I love
doing this. I love doing audio.
I love talking. I love
experimenting with it

32:39.520 --> 32:42.480
a lot of construction going on
today by the way. You probably
hear that in the background

32:44.560 --> 32:46.560
So there's

32:46.880 --> 32:53.520
There's ways that will be able
to do that and we need some
infrastructure obviously to make
that happen

32:53.520 --> 32:58.800
So that if you have an idea and
you want a podcast first we
should make the podcasting part
pretty easy you know

32:58.800 --> 33:01.040
How about just click record
click done

33:02.000 --> 33:09.360
Or pick up the phone and call a
number and hit pound and it's
done and you've got your feet
and you've got your your archive
and and show notes

33:09.920 --> 33:15.440
This is going to be important
show notes is going to be
important. I'm really happy that
I started out by

33:15.760 --> 33:19.680
Doing it in OPML even though
it's really had it's made no
sense up until now

33:20.080 --> 33:22.880
But a lot of people are doing it
and I really appreciate you
following along

33:26.080 --> 33:28.080
Because

33:28.400 --> 33:35.200
The next thing that's going to
happen is we're going to have to
be able to find stuff based upon
the content inside the podcast

33:35.520 --> 33:41.600
So you know these directories
like we have at ipod.org and
other ones that kind of take the
ID3 tag information

33:41.600 --> 33:42.880
It's not going to be enough

33:43.200 --> 33:48.640
We have to add extra metadata to
the podcast in order to make
them indexable searchable

33:49.280 --> 33:51.280
Got a couple of ideas about that

33:52.000 --> 33:56.240
And then on the sponsoring
sponsoring advertising. I think
are two different things

33:57.040 --> 34:02.320
And I've been listening around
to a couple of podcasts my my
favorite example is WGBH in
Boston

34:02.880 --> 34:09.520
WGBH a WGBH is morning stories
are sponsored by ipswitch and
ipswitch is a

34:10.400 --> 34:12.880
Provider of downloading tools
connectivity

34:12.880 --> 34:16.240
It sounds like a provider. I'm
not quite sure but I remember
the name right and

34:18.240 --> 34:22.240
So in a perfect NPR model which
to me just sounds like it's
commercial

34:22.720 --> 34:29.760
I don't see any difference
between this program brought to
you by ipswitch for morning
stories or you know this program
brought to you by

34:29.760 --> 34:35.680
MS mobiles for Don and Drew. I
don't see any difference there,
but apparently there, you know,
it's I guess there is

34:36.560 --> 34:42.640
Maybe because the show maybe
that's a throwback to the to the
good old days where if a show is
interrupted by

34:43.920 --> 34:48.400
Commercials then it's a
commercial show but if it's
sponsored by the beginning in
the end and you're not

34:49.280 --> 34:54.000
And you're not interrupting the
flow of the program then it's
not commercial

34:54.000 --> 35:02.720
So anyway, I'd call that
sponsoring or underwriting and
we're seeing lots of that happen
already and I and I and I
encourage that and what you're
gonna get is you're gonna get
people who are specifically

35:02.720 --> 35:12.640
Underwriting a podcast for the
content of the podcast or the
audience that will be listening
to that to that podcast and it's
like you don't really need
numbers to prove it

35:13.600 --> 35:16.240
Because the sponsor intuitively
knows

35:16.960 --> 35:20.880
The people that I'm gonna reach
there are the ones that I want
to reach because it's just clear

35:20.880 --> 35:26.080
It's not based upon the shotgun
approach of I've got 8 million
listeners, so you know

35:26.080 --> 35:30.640
You just want to buy a spot with
me because you're just blasting
it out and you're always gonna
get someone you want

35:31.520 --> 35:35.600
There is a way to do that by the
way, and I'm not against it. I
think it's a very

35:35.920 --> 35:40.960
Interesting idea, but we have to
bond together and this is the
long tail that people talk about
you know

35:41.200 --> 35:45.680
So we'll have if we have a
couple hundred podcasters just
like the you

35:46.240 --> 35:50.720
Weblogs, so there's a couple
weblogs that everyone knows
about and get get shit loads of
traffic

35:51.520 --> 35:57.520
But then there's this millions
of weblogs that all get little
80 bit of bits of part of of
traffic

35:58.000 --> 36:01.360
And if you can find it if we can
find a way collectively to

36:02.320 --> 36:06.640
Use each of those smaller
audiences to aggregate them into
a big audience

36:07.040 --> 36:13.360
That will create something that
the advertisers who understand
the shotgun approach and that's
what they like to do

36:13.360 --> 36:15.360
It was just you know fucking
load on baby

36:16.240 --> 36:18.240
We'll get someone

36:18.240 --> 36:21.680
We can do that. We can totally
do that. So I think a
combination

36:22.480 --> 36:24.640
By him I have to say most
excited about

36:25.440 --> 36:30.000
Being able to talk about a
product or maybe just you know
going to a store how about that

36:30.000 --> 36:34.800
You know if you just if you just
go into an online store and say
I really like that product and I
want to sell that

36:34.800 --> 36:40.240
I want to advertise that we
could turn this whole fucking
thing around think about that so
instead of

36:40.560 --> 36:45.360
You determining you know saying
okay, you can come and advertise
with your cell phone, right?

36:45.360 --> 36:47.360
So the virgin mobile

36:47.360 --> 36:50.160
Says I want advertising your
show. Why don't I

36:51.040 --> 36:53.040
Have an opportunity to go to
some place

36:54.000 --> 37:01.280
Where I can go through a whole
bunch of products and services
or I can search for one that I
perhaps like already and know
that I want to talk about

37:01.600 --> 37:07.120
Because I'm passionate about it
if I like something or a
particular cigar that I smoked
and go and get

37:07.600 --> 37:13.840
The the automatic right to
market that product that would
turn it all upside down and then
the

37:13.840 --> 37:19.360
The longer I'm on this plan at
the more I'm seeing in recent
years that if you turn the model
upside down

37:19.360 --> 37:21.280
It's usually exactly what people
are looking for

37:21.280 --> 37:24.320
I don't know why but it seems
that way it's like you know
instead of streaming

37:24.320 --> 37:25.680
We're gonna do

37:25.680 --> 37:30.800
We're gonna do caching basically
and put stuff on your on your
machine that you don't know
about and tell you about it
later

37:30.800 --> 37:35.760
I mean everything if you turn
the paradigm upside down it
usually starts to make sense in
our new world

37:36.080 --> 37:40.480
And so I'm pretty excited about
that idea of just being able to
go into it into an online store

37:40.480 --> 37:45.200
Choose a product that I like or
search for the product that I
like and as I talk about it on
my podcast

37:45.200 --> 37:51.440
Send people back to my website
my weblog whatever wherever I
post my podcast and say, hey,
you know click on

37:51.920 --> 37:56.720
Click on that link and get some
more information about it or buy
it, you know, then all I'm doing
is I'm just I

37:56.720 --> 38:04.480
Become the market or the
advertiser and I determine what
I'm going to sell and I can hone
my skills with my advertising
message

38:05.120 --> 38:07.600
To my audience like Michael
Butler

38:08.320 --> 38:11.600
He had did a sponsorship or a
commercial someone

38:11.600 --> 38:13.600
I think I think they were
basically going to give him free
beer

38:14.000 --> 38:17.680
Which is fine? That's that's
what Michael wants right now.
You want some free beer

38:17.680 --> 38:20.320
Heinrich and you idiots you
idiots

38:20.960 --> 38:22.960
You know talk about that later

38:22.960 --> 38:28.800
And he on the spot he made up a
song and sang it for him and
that was it, you know because he
knows how to talk to his
audience

38:29.360 --> 38:33.920
To anyway hey let's play some
pod save music and I still want
to do the hit you know what or

38:34.560 --> 38:39.840
I'm going to save the pod save
music because we're 38 minutes
already. It is time once again
everybody for the hit

38:44.480 --> 38:47.200
The answer that is test 10
bucks. I got your answers

38:48.240 --> 38:50.240
Time for Adam Curry to take the
hit test

38:51.440 --> 38:53.440
With y'all polette

38:53.840 --> 39:00.000
Hi Adam. Hey on it's time for
hit test number 13. I'm ready my
brother again. There are some
changes

39:00.960 --> 39:06.640
Okay, in the format the clips
are very short. You'll you'll
hear each clip two times

39:08.160 --> 39:12.800
And right after you'll have five
seconds to think about it. Oh,
here we go. There's clip number
one

39:17.040 --> 39:19.040
And once again number one

39:21.680 --> 39:23.680
And how are you gonna five
seconds to think about it

39:24.160 --> 39:30.720
Okay, I don't like this new
format young. I'm not good at
it. Time for number two

39:35.200 --> 39:37.200
Once again number two

39:39.440 --> 39:42.720
Sounds like a Mr. Mr. Okay, five
seconds for you

39:44.800 --> 39:49.680
And sound like Mr. Mr. But
again, and this is number three

39:49.760 --> 39:55.280
It's very short one more time

39:57.520 --> 40:00.240
Okay hold on hold on all right
young

40:01.280 --> 40:06.000
This sucks at least I suck. I
can't finish five seconds for
you to think about it

40:06.560 --> 40:10.880
My goodness, you know when I
hear these songs I'm going to
say oh, yeah, I knew what it was
right it's too early

40:10.880 --> 40:14.240
Maybe for me and I would start
for the answer section number
one

40:19.680 --> 40:26.640
It's gross, but that's a 90s
soft. I don't know so much about
the 90s, you know, I need some
old fit

40:30.560 --> 40:33.200
Okay, I would never guess that
even if you played it for an
hour

40:38.880 --> 40:41.520
And the second answer in today's
hit justice

40:42.240 --> 40:47.040
This curiosity killed the cats.
Oh, man

40:47.920 --> 40:52.560
This is down to earth. Okay, I
could have known that that's
like 83

40:55.920 --> 40:57.920
Song

40:58.400 --> 41:00.400
Me

41:09.200 --> 41:11.200
And the third and final answer

41:12.480 --> 41:14.480
It's a richy family

41:14.960 --> 41:17.440
With me a break and cowbell to
boot

41:28.160 --> 41:30.160
I got the nation

41:31.440 --> 41:33.680
Did anyone get those the anyone
get those?

41:35.200 --> 41:38.480
The richy family is answering
number three in today's hit test

41:39.840 --> 41:42.320
Well, and please let me know
what you think of the changes
I've made

41:43.760 --> 41:48.080
A lot of feedback is welcome at
hittest at gmail.com

41:49.120 --> 41:50.800
Hittest at gmail.com

41:52.240 --> 41:54.960
And the site has already changed
again

41:55.920 --> 42:00.480
You've been find all information
on www.yumpolets.nl

42:01.040 --> 42:04.240
So let's g a and p-o-l-e-t.nl

42:05.600 --> 42:11.840
You can find information about
the hittest the RSS feed and the
new independent hittest podcast

42:13.120 --> 42:15.120
There have been already two

42:16.320 --> 42:19.680
Check them out at
www.yumpolets.nl

42:21.200 --> 42:23.200
See you next time

42:24.960 --> 42:26.960
Like we've started a little
cottage industry here

42:27.120 --> 42:30.880
Yumpolets got his hit test
podcast going check them out

42:31.280 --> 42:35.040
Yumpolet.nl thank you very much
yum. No, I think it's great the
four minus great

42:35.600 --> 42:39.120
Could I have ten seconds or so
two things one I'd like ten
seconds to think about it

42:40.320 --> 42:45.520
And the clue well first of all,
I wouldn't have gotten these I a
curiosity killed the cap

42:45.520 --> 42:48.960
Nost and my brain is too fried
for that richy family

42:50.080 --> 42:54.880
It wasn't one I mean because you
know what I know so many songs
because I've played so many
songs

42:55.040 --> 42:59.760
Over and over and over again on
the radio and that's just one
that you know, I've never played
curiosity killed a cat

42:59.760 --> 43:01.760
I could have known and

43:03.520 --> 43:05.520
What was the I even forgot the
first

43:07.360 --> 43:11.280
So now I just suck this time,
but give me yeah give me like
ten seconds in between that's
great

43:11.280 --> 43:14.400
I love the I love hearing you
know the snipers the the snip's

43:15.280 --> 43:17.280
twice in a row

43:17.680 --> 43:21.760
What's always hard though is to
is the clues of the hardest
things because you want people
to be able to guess

43:21.840 --> 43:23.760
You want to have you know give
me a little bit of a chance

43:24.240 --> 43:28.560
I we did this on the radio back
in the 80s mood play like just
like just like a

43:29.040 --> 43:33.440
Not even a second worth of audio
and people would still get it so
I think the length of the clips
are good

43:34.160 --> 43:38.480
I just yeah, and I just suck
what can I say I'm looking
forward to tomorrow's though

43:38.480 --> 43:44.080
That'll be a very exciting. Hey,
I'm going to wind it up 43
minutes 40 seconds. That's it
for today's source code

43:46.800 --> 43:48.800
Thank y'all for checking it out

43:49.040 --> 43:53.280
Better on the hit test than I
did tomorrow. I will be back.
We'll know how the wider the
words went

43:54.720 --> 43:57.520
And another day in San Francisco
then it's off to

43:57.840 --> 44:00.880
Seattle and then back home. I
can't wait. I must say I'm

44:02.000 --> 44:04.000
This is my girls a bit these
days

44:07.120 --> 44:09.120
comments at him at curry.com

44:09.120 --> 44:13.120
I have not had time to empty out
the MP3 feedback at gmail.com
account

44:13.920 --> 44:15.920
I guess the only way to really
do it is to

44:16.880 --> 44:22.000
Pop all that mail out of there
or delete it and then basically
let it fill up again, you know

44:22.560 --> 44:26.000
Google I love Google. I'm
willing to pay for more storage

44:26.640 --> 44:28.640
I will pay Google just let me
know

44:29.200 --> 44:34.640
Famous source code dot promise
where you can find the archive
the latest show in the podcast
the and of course my weblog

44:34.720 --> 44:40.000
WWW dot free god prom. I'll talk
to you tomorrow everybody take
care have a great day. Bye bye

44:45.920 --> 44:47.920
you